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Steinhoff


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#41 Tom

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Posted 01 July 2020 - 04:06 PM

More false and misleading publicity:

 

https://af.reuters.c...KBN2425AK-OZABS "Steinhoff faces legal claims of more than $10 billion": Even though 2 days ago the South African court ruled that ex-shareholders cannot sue for losses.

 

https://www.biznews....f-advisory-fees "Steinhoff advisory fees soar as accounting scandal lingers": Even though those (advisory 158 million euros) fees aren't any major expense for a big company like Steinhoff, and only once off.

 

https://www.business...to-remain-high/ "Steinhoff expects advisory fees to fall in 2020, but legal fees to remain high": Legal fees aren't the straw that can break Steinhoff's back.


Edited by Tom, 01 July 2020 - 04:11 PM.

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#42 DayTraderDad

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Posted 01 July 2020 - 01:02 PM

In addition to my previous posts I also want to point out the negative parts:

-We do sit at a negative NAV
-We still have around 9.6 Billion debt to repay with abnormal high interest rates
- Third year with a loss
- Operating cash flow still negative
-No clean audit opinion
-massive legal claims against Steinhoff
-COVID19 impact not determinable yet.
-Conforama future is uncertain
-exchange rates uncertain

I think these are the most critical parts we are facing at the moment.
If we can now fix these or see progress here Steinhoff can be saved.
This process will however take time and I'm not expecting this to be finalized before the end of 2021.

Again this is my personal own view and no recommendation to buy or sell shares.

Andi I think Conforama not in good shape and we waiting on important anouncemnt which should be coming out very soon of a posible sale. I think people are waiting.


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#43 Investment novice

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Posted 01 July 2020 - 12:50 PM

I just can't shake the fact that management always report passively and have gone to extreme lengths to depress the share price. Even when there was no immediate need to issue a second sens on the covid impact they announced it with doom and gloom. I always seem to wonder that they do want to show poverty but really to buyout and duelist the prized goose and realist it piecemeal... Not sure the intentions.

The afs is detailed and is a great step forward..... A golden goose for grand kids.....

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#44 andi222

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Posted 01 July 2020 - 12:16 PM

In addition to my previous posts I also want to point out the negative parts:

-We do sit at a negative NAV
-We still have around 9.6 Billion debt to repay with abnormal high interest rates
- Third year with a loss
- Operating cash flow still negative
-No clean audit opinion
-massive legal claims against Steinhoff
-COVID19 impact not determinable yet.
-Conforama future is uncertain
-exchange rates uncertain

I think these are the most critical parts we are facing at the moment.
If we can now fix these or see progress here Steinhoff can be saved.
This process will however take time and I'm not expecting this to be finalized before the end of 2021.

Again this is my personal own view and no recommendation to buy or sell shares.
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#45 andi222

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Posted 01 July 2020 - 11:22 AM

I had a look at the AFS 2019. At first it looks horrible, Equity at negative 2.4 Billion € and a loss of 1.84 billion €.

However looking into it one can see what an impressive job the management has done to keep this ship sailing into the right direction. Even though management has performed exceptionally well during the period their remuneration went down from 45 Million to 29 Million €.

 

Now to the key highlights after the reporting period:

-Sold Blue Group for 10 Million

-Sold part of Greenlit for 40 Million €

- Disposal of Unitrans of 300 Million €

- Sale of Sherwood of 50 Million €

- Properties disposed of 280 Million €

All these proceeds are not reflected in the cash balance yet. 680 Million Additional cash.

 

Now looking at the operational performance:

Revenue grew to 12 billion € from continued operations.

Loss however came in at 1.84 billion €. This looks terrible at the first look. BUT we have to take the following into consideration:

Once off Advisory Fees: 160 Million

Interest expense 1.1 billion (Which is capitalized at the moment and will hopefully be refinanced at way lower interest rates after 2021)

Loss from discontinued operations 450 Million (These units will be gone in the near future)

Impairments of: 400 Million (Additional once off impairments have occurred) hopefully the last ones as there is basically nothing left to write down)

Conforama restructure charges 217 Million once off.

Amortization/Depreciation charges of around 200 Million.

This actually gives you a profit of around 0.9 to 1 billion.

 

Other highlights:

Net stores increased by 550 stores

MF is valued at 9 Million € in the books, MF is worth way more after the restructure.

 

Net debt levels

Current: 9.6 billion

This includes a 180 Million take up of MF loans 180 Million MF.

The actual debt should have been at 9.1 billion opening balance plus the 1.1 billion interest. So we would be sitting at 10.2 billion plus the 180 Million take up of MF. This gives us around 10.4 billion.

But guys have you noticed that the Actual balance sits at 9.6 Billion € as at 30.9.2019.

Which means that Steinhoff has reduced the loans by around 0.8 Billion €.

 

We are on a good way guys. I think management is still following a very conservative approach and they use every opportunity to account for values at the lowest possible value. Again I think this is to act poor for the litigation's to come. 

 

Also litigation seem to be ongoing. Luckily no provisions have been raised yet which means no claims are certain as of today. If a claim would have been probable they would need to immediately record a provision.

 

Also regarding the audit opinion:

We had the following number of points which formed the basis of disclaimer of opinion:

2017: 9 points

2018: 8 points

2019: Only 6 points left.

Material uncertainty related to going concern – This one will disappear once litigation are sorted or more long term loans are secured.

Material uncertainty with respect to litigation- Relates to point 1

Material uncertainty with respect to uncertain tax positions – Might be solved for 2020

Material uncertainty with respect to the share in the investment in Conforama - Might be solved for 2020

Material uncertainty with respect to the audit evidence of Conforama - Might be solved for 2020

Material uncertainty with respect to the foreign currency translation reserve - Might be solved for 2020

 

Again this is just my personal own opinion of the AFS 2019. Looking forward to the HJ 2020 results as we will then be up to date also with the reporting timelines.

 


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#46 Tom

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Posted 01 July 2020 - 09:34 AM

It's the false or misleading reporting of the media:

- They reported the court case win for Steinhoff, as it was a loss for the share holders (but they didn't state on the main title "previous share holders").

- They reported the financials as if Steinhoff is a money losing business, while the loss was due to the CVA arrangement expenses which was once off, and the high interest on the pre-CVA loans, while Steinhoff after the report managed to refinance at a lower interest rate many debt and still looking to finance, and with the interest rate being very low now because of the lock downs crisis, and with governments around the world are trying to give business interest free loans, then Steinhoff can keep applying for these cheap loans, and there are very good chances of getting many of these cheap loans for Steinhoff.

 

These two media reports are false or misleading:

https://www.moneyweb...f-shareholders/

https://af.reuters.c...s/idAFL4N2E8041


Edited by Tom, 01 July 2020 - 09:35 AM.

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#47 Tom

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Posted 01 July 2020 - 09:30 AM

Operationally Steinhoff is a money making business, and just need to refinance it's CVA higher than market interest loans to the same interest rate as any other business interest rate, and that can properly happen when the creditors see that Steinhoff has a very good EBITDA (€877 million). Or the governments give it a Lock Downs recovery stimulus loans at a low or interest free.


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#48 Tom

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Posted 01 July 2020 - 09:21 AM

It's the false or misleading reporting of the media:

- They reported the court case win for Steinhoff, as it was a loss for the share holders (but they didn't state on the main title "previous share holders").

- They reported the financials as if Steinhoff is a money losing business, while the loss was due to the CVA arrangement expenses which was once off, and the high interest on the pre-CVA loans, while Steinhoff after the report managed to refinance at a lower interest rate many debt and still looking to finance, and with the interest rate being very low now because of the lock downs crisis, and with governments around the world are trying to give business interest free loans, then Steinhoff can keep applying for these cheap loans, and there are very good chances of getting many of these cheap loans for Steinhoff.


Edited by Tom, 01 July 2020 - 09:23 AM.

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#49 woolhoff

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Posted 01 July 2020 - 09:07 AM

[quote name="DayTraderDad" post="292081" timestamp="1593585853"]

Follow the link and see massive volumes at open: [url="https://www.tradegate.de/orderbuch

Same **** different day
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#50 new john

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Posted 01 July 2020 - 08:58 AM

Time to start filling those bags.

Staying loooooong on this one. Dividends for grand kiddies.
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#51 DayTraderDad

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Posted 01 July 2020 - 08:44 AM

 It touched a new low 0.0401. Coud be someone dumping and took out all stops.

Follow the link and see massive volumes at open: https://www.tradegat...in=NL0011375019


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#52 DayTraderDad

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Posted 01 July 2020 - 08:40 AM

I think the negative equity is a problem but 24 mil shares traded in 40 min tradegate

 It touched a new low 0.0401. Coud be someone dumping and took out all stops.


Edited by DayTraderDad, 01 July 2020 - 08:41 AM.

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#53 Lionelza1

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Posted 01 July 2020 - 08:39 AM

Any ideas whats driving this ?


I would say all the uncertainties with this company... Mr Market does not like uncertainties.....

Always be careful of the pump on this share before an event.... It will suck you in..

When this share starts pumping AFTER info is released.... Then it's time to jump on
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#54 DayTraderDad

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Posted 01 July 2020 - 08:36 AM

Any ideas whats driving this ?

I think the negative equity is a problem but 24 mil shares traded in 40 min tradegate


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#55 AnbanM

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Posted 01 July 2020 - 08:31 AM

What was the highpoint and whats it on now? A shame that it never closed on a high. If its still mid way up hopefully it will pickup again gradually



High was about .061 Euro last night, now at .0484 euro
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#56 woolhoff

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Posted 01 July 2020 - 08:26 AM

yes


What was the highpoint and whats it on now? A shame that it never closed on a high. If its still mid way up hopefully it will pickup again gradually
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#57 AnbanM

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Posted 01 July 2020 - 08:25 AM

Is this on tradegate?


yes
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#58 woolhoff

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Posted 01 July 2020 - 08:16 AM

Any ideas whats driving this ?


Is this on tradegate?
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#59 AnbanM

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Posted 01 July 2020 - 08:13 AM

Holy crap... One moer se dump


Any ideas whats driving this ?
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#60 Lionelza1

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Posted 01 July 2020 - 07:56 AM

Ah all info released.... What are you guys expecting to happen w.r.t share movement?

I'm expecting to see one moer se pomp


Holy crap... One moer se dump
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