35854 replies to this topic

[Argento]

I also like trading with big amounts and that is why I lost a lot when I started trading, especially trying to go in and out everyday!

 

I still play big amounts but catch the larger movements (daily/weekly timeframe signals) and from then I began to trade profitable, problem with day trading is you can have 7 winning trades and it only takes 1 bad trade to cancel them all, then all the time and effort down the drain!

 

But it is about your strategy, there is traders that make good money trading like that and kudo's to them, playing the bigger movements let me sleep at night and I don't need to watch my phone so often that drove my wife insane!

 

Example:

 

There is a big move down coming soon that could be in the range of 8000 points, sitting tight is not easy but few traders can say they caught such a movement, and I am planning to do so!She is nearing her monthly bollingerband and once that line is breached and she comes back it will give the sell signal and time to go in bigtime. Then after the drop she will go for new highs again for the final bullmarket top so another 8000 points to be long and sit tight.....we are now in the euphoria phase of buying that will soon dry up, but still think the indexes have more upside with a month/2 to go, SPX can even overshoot to 2000!But she will show us when she turns.....

 

A

Just to put my view in graph terms, you can see in 2007 when she moved through the monthly bollingerband a sell signal was given for a huge drop that kicked off the bullmarket top formation!She is moving along the current bollingerband and we know QE3 is ending around September, if you look at the previous programs she tends to top a month/2 before so around July/August she should move through and confirm a top with a pot of gold short if you play it right!

 

The Kress/40/7 year cycle is due to make its low in October so from there we should see one last top/new high in 2015 to end the big primary wave 5 since 2009 and end the bullmarket!

 

A

Attached Files

•  TOP40 (Monthly view).jpg   172.77KB   6 downloads

[grantmu]

Grantmu...

For me the answer to your question and approach lies in the status of being consistently profitable. Once you have achieved that, then player a large number of contracts is fine...no emotion....since you have achieved a consistent level of winnings with you system.

I am not there yet, so....in the process I play small contracts whilst getting to the level of being constantly profitable.

Enjoy the process

Well the problem I have is that from my point of view the market is more about emotion than actual numbers, so the last problem I need to work out is I may know the emotion at the moment and that makes me successful, but how do I identify the emotion change. I have been getting it right for the past 1.5 years, but before that I was not so good at hitting it. So the reason I am looking at this is to say if I am doing well at the moment it may be time to take advantage of that

[Argento]

Grantmu...

For me the answer to your question and approach lies in the status of being consistently profitable. Once you have achieved that, then player a large number of contracts is fine...no emotion....since you have achieved a consistent level of winnings with you system.

I am not there yet, so....in the process I play small contracts whilst getting to the level of being constantly profitable.

Enjoy the process

Well said!!

 

A

[Argento]

At the moment I agree with you and have been trading the swings up until now, I am trying to work out if there is a better way to deal with day trading. I am trading much smaller amounts a the moment and the only reason I am asking this question is that the smaller amounts seem to for now be working, scaling this up should also work but I may be wrong on this and I am still feeling my way around day trading. long term trading has worked for 100 years and will probably work for 100 more, BUT is a new way of trading possible, and if so what are the risks.

I also like trading with big amounts and that is why I lost a lot when I started trading, especially trying to go in and out everyday!

 

I still play big amounts but catch the larger movements (daily/weekly timeframe signals) and from then I began to trade profitable, problem with day trading is you can have 7 winning trades and it only takes 1 bad trade to cancel them all, then all the time and effort down the drain!

 

But it is about your strategy, there is traders that make good money trading like that and kudo's to them, playing the bigger movements let me sleep at night and I don't need to watch my phone so often that drove my wife insane!

 

Example:

 

There is a big move down coming soon that could be in the range of 8000 points, sitting tight is not easy but few traders can say they caught such a movement, and I am planning to do so!She is nearing her monthly bollingerband and once that line is breached and she comes back it will give the sell signal and time to go in bigtime. Then after the drop she will go for new highs again for the final bullmarket top so another 8000 points to be long and sit tight.....we are now in the euphoria phase of buying that will soon dry up, but still think the indexes have more upside with a month/2 to go, SPX can even overshoot to 2000!But she will show us when she turns.....

 

A

Edited by Argento, 17 June 2014 - 09:51 AM.

[Plasma]

Grantmu...

For me the answer to your question and approach lies in the status of being consistently profitable. Once you have achieved that, then player a large number of contracts is fine...no emotion....since you have achieved a consistent level of winnings with you system.

I am not there yet, so....in the process I play small contracts whilst getting to the level of being constantly profitable.

Enjoy the process

[grantmu]

I was working off 20 contracts (your maximum) at R50 per point x 100 points which gives R100000 profit/loss per trade?

 

Not a bad strategy, but playing with these numbers requires a large account and nerves of steel to be disciplined to stop out if necessary... otherwise it is account cleanout time!

 

K

done that a few times in the past, may happen again, Still it may be worth it if I can get emotion out of the trade and just follow the rules.  

[delta66]

Grant..forget bigger no's..play R2micro's you can make thousands a day

trade the channel(high-low)

[K~~]

Everything in life is a risk so I see this differently, I trust my entry pints, they don't all work but as long as I win more than I loose it should all work out. I have been trading longer CFD's of between 2 and 10 days and only recently (2 months) tried the day trading strategy. the reason for the question was if i am going to invest more time into perfecting a day trading strategy then there needs to be some decent prospects of making money, if not then day trading will only be something to do while waiting for the other CFD.s to hit the marks. 

 

On the days I loose that is just the cost of doing business and the value I lost is not something I am going to try and recover, it is just a trade that did not work. sell out and look for the next trade.

 

don't get me wrong there are some days that i loose fairly large amounts of money, i sell the trade at a loss leave the computer and do something else for the rest of the day, the next day I am looking for entry points again. 

 

also I think you miss interpret big ones, it is full size contracts, they cost R6000.00 per contract and work out at R50 per point, so 5 contracts is R250 per point, multiply that by 100 points is the potential profit or loss you would sustain. 

I was working off 20 contracts (your maximum) at R50 per point x 100 points which gives R100000 profit/loss per trade?

 

Not a bad strategy, but playing with these numbers requires a large account and nerves of steel to be disciplined to stop out if necessary... otherwise it is account cleanout time!

 

K

[grantmu]

there is liquidity on the bigger numbers on most days/sessions...strange Q from you Grant, you may know me in the real world if you were on the PBS team meeting early sat evening

 

be very cautious of playing those numbers, if you do...consult with ppl who have done it before..ie professional advisers(there's ways and means of building contingencies into this type of play)

Problem is there seem to be very few willing to risk very large amounts on the SA40, I am trying to find people playing this game hence the question to the group.. 

[grantmu]

If you want to make 30-50 K a day playing the daily fluctuations on the TOP40:

 

1) You are risking too much capital

2) Your account will be wiped soon

 

Talking out of experience and everybody knows my view on day trading, big money lies in the big swings!

 

Read what the greatest trader alive had to say about this subject..attached!

 

A

At the moment I agree with you and have been trading the swings up until now, I am trying to work out if there is a better way to deal with day trading. I am trading much smaller amounts a the moment and the only reason I am asking this question is that the smaller amounts seem to for now be working, scaling this up should also work but I may be wrong on this and I am still feeling my way around day trading. long term trading has worked for 100 years and will probably work for 100 more, BUT is a new way of trading possible, and if so what are the risks.

[delta66]

run baby run(T40) ..if only every week started out like this

[grantmu]

Hi G

 

20 IG Big Ones! Maybe Warren Buffett can play that... That's R44,5 MILLION notional value.

 

True, given 100 points movement yielding R100,000 - doesn't look bad if you're on the winning side...   But, if you lose - 

 

If you work off a stop loss off 100 points (given a rather meagre 1:1 R&R ratio), and assuming a 2% risk per trade, then your account size should be R5 Million to play..

 

If you pull it off.. you don't belong on this forum! 

 

Prosperous trading!

 

K

Everything in life is a risk so I see this differently, I trust my entry pints, they don't all work but as long as I win more than I loose it should all work out. I have been trading longer CFD's of between 2 and 10 days and only recently (2 months) tried the day trading strategy. the reason for the question was if i am going to invest more time into perfecting a day trading strategy then there needs to be some decent prospects of making money, if not then day trading will only be something to do while waiting for the other CFD.s to hit the marks. 

 

On the days I loose that is just the cost of doing business and the value I lost is not something I am going to try and recover, it is just a trade that did not work. sell out and look for the next trade.

 

don't get me wrong there are some days that i loose fairly large amounts of money, i sell the trade at a loss leave the computer and do something else for the rest of the day, the next day I am looking for entry points again. 

 

also I think you miss interpret big ones, it is full size contracts, they cost R6000.00 per contract and work out at R50 per point, so 5 contracts is R250 per point, multiply that by 100 points is the potential profit or loss you would sustain. 

[Argento]

target for the day would be 30 - 50 K

 

If you are going to play you may as well try to win and make it worth while. that is the same targets I have playing CFD's at the moment, sometimes I hit he mark and sometimes a miss big time, at the end of the month I hope for more up than down. 

If you want to make 30-50 K a day playing the daily fluctuations on the TOP40:

 

1) You are risking too much capital

2) Your account will be wiped soon

 

Talking out of experience and everybody knows my view on day trading, big money lies in the big swings!

 

Read what the greatest trader alive had to say about this subject..attached!

 

A

Attached Files

•  Trading Attitude.JPG   958.64KB   3 downloads

Edited by Argento, 17 June 2014 - 08:59 AM.

[delta66]

there is liquidity on the bigger numbers on most days/sessions...strange Q from you Grant, you may know me in the real world if you were on the PBS team meeting early sat evening

 

be very cautious of playing those numbers, if you do...consult with ppl who have done it before..ie professional advisers(there's ways and means of building contingencies into this type of play)

[grantmu]

PS: IG limits the number of contracts that can be sold at once during after hours trading and during the opening of the futures market at 08:30 in the morning. 

 

I was unable once trying to offload 3 big ones at the same time around 08:30, and had to do it one at a time...

 

During market hours, the most big ones I have unloaded at once is seven, this happened in an instant, without any problems...

 

What the maximum is, I don't know... but because this is the market, there will be times when you won't be able to offload... If there aren't buyers/sellers around, then tough luck!

 

Prosperous trading!

 

K

Thanks, I think that answers my question. 

[grantmu]

Wat is a 'decent amount of money' for one day?

target for the day would be 30 - 50 K

 

If you are going to play you may as well try to win and make it worth while. that is the same targets I have playing CFD's at the moment, sometimes I hit he mark and sometimes a miss big time, at the end of the month I hope for more up than down. 

[Qbre77]

This day trading thing is getting to be quite addictive. the question I hope someone in the group can answer is the following.

 

In order to make a decent amount of money trading a singe day with such low movements requires a larger amount of contracts. so the question is taking out 10 - 20 full size contracts and then move only 100 points, how difficult is it to offload the contracts at the target specified in the sell order.

Does anyone in the group have experience and if so what is seen as the maximum number of contracts that could be sold off in a single event.

 

As a second point, if the number is limited would selling off a percentage every couple of points make any difference and if so what would the number of points be.

 

I ask this because using IG there is no market depth so I cant see the contract orders and offers on IG, I can see the J200 but that is a pure index, I cant see the satrix index and I can see depth on all other stocks.

 

anyone have any help or advise on this.

Wat is a 'decent amount of money' for one day?

[K~~]

Hi G

 

20 IG Big Ones! Maybe Warren Buffett can play that... That's R44,5 MILLION notional value.

 

True, given 100 points movement yielding R100,000 - doesn't look bad if you're on the winning side...   But, if you lose - 

 

If you work off a stop loss off 100 points (given a rather meagre 1:1 R&R ratio), and assuming a 2% risk per trade, then your account size should be R5 Million to play..

 

If you pull it off.. you don't belong on this forum! 

 

Prosperous trading!

 

K

 

 

This day trading thing is getting to be quite addictive. the question I hope someone in the group can answer is the following.

 

In order to make a decent amount of money trading a singe day with such low movements requires a larger amount of contracts. so the question is taking out 10 - 20 full size contracts and then move only 100 points, how difficult is it to offload the contracts at the target specified in the sell order.

Does anyone in the group have experience and if so what is seen as the maximum number of contracts that could be sold off in a single event.

 

As a second point, if the number is limited would selling off a percentage every couple of points make any difference and if so what would the number of points be.

 

I ask this because using IG there is no market depth so I cant see the contract orders and offers on IG, I can see the J200 but that is a pure index, I cant see the satrix index and I can see depth on all other stocks.

 

anyone have any help or advise on this.

PS: IG limits the number of contracts that can be sold at once during after hours trading and during the opening of the futures market at 08:30 in the morning. 

 

I was unable once trying to offload 3 big ones at the same time around 08:30, and had to do it one at a time...

 

During market hours, the most big ones I have unloaded at once is seven, this happened in an instant, without any problems...

 

What the maximum is, I don't know... but because this is the market, there will be times when you won't be able to offload... If there aren't buyers/sellers around, then tough luck!

 

Prosperous trading!

 

K

[K~~]

This day trading thing is getting to be quite addictive. the question I hope someone in the group can answer is the following.

 

In order to make a decent amount of money trading a singe day with such low movements requires a larger amount of contracts. so the question is taking out 10 - 20 full size contracts and then move only 100 points, how difficult is it to offload the contracts at the target specified in the sell order.

Does anyone in the group have experience and if so what is seen as the maximum number of contracts that could be sold off in a single event.

 

As a second point, if the number is limited would selling off a percentage every couple of points make any difference and if so what would the number of points be.

 

I ask this because using IG there is no market depth so I cant see the contract orders and offers on IG, I can see the J200 but that is a pure index, I cant see the satrix index and I can see depth on all other stocks.

 

anyone have any help or advise on this.

Hi G

 

20 IG Big Ones! Maybe Warren Buffett can play that... That's R44,5 MILLION notional value.

 

True, given 100 points movement yielding R100,000 - doesn't look bad if you're on the winning side...   But, if you lose - 

 

If you work off a stop loss off 100 points (given a rather meagre 1:1 R&R ratio), and assuming a 2% risk per trade, then your account size should be R5 Million to play..

 

If you pull it off.. you don't belong on this forum! 

 

Prosperous trading!

 

K

[grantmu]

This day trading thing is getting to be quite addictive. the question I hope someone in the group can answer is the following.

 

In order to make a decent amount of money trading a singe day with such low movements requires a larger amount of contracts. so the question is taking out 10 - 20 full size contracts and then move only 100 points, how difficult is it to offload the contracts at the target specified in the sell order.

Does anyone in the group have experience and if so what is seen as the maximum number of contracts that could be sold off in a single event.

 

As a second point, if the number is limited would selling off a percentage every couple of points make any difference and if so what would the number of points be.

 

I ask this because using IG there is no market depth so I cant see the contract orders and offers on IG, I can see the J200 but that is a pure index, I cant see the satrix index and I can see depth on all other stocks.

 

anyone have any help or advise on this.