15225 replies to this topic

[DayTraderDad]

Next piece of the restructure puzzle in place: Steinhoff International Holdings N.V. : DISPOSAL BY STEINHOFF, THROUGH ITS SUBSIDIARY STEINHOFF AFRICA HOLDINGS PROPRIETARY LIMITED ('STEINHOFF AFRICA'), OF 74.9% OF THE SHARES OF UNITRANS MOTOR HOLDINGS PROPRIETARY LIMITED ('UNITRANS') AND 100% OF THE LOAN CLAIMS HELD BY STEINHOFF AFRICA AGAINST UNITRANS

[Lionelza1]

   

Tom 2 comforting facts for me

1 - Creditors are giving steinhoff support - extremely important
2 - Customers are not boycotting steinhoff, steinhoff still generating sales

Take either 1 away and u have beginning of your insolvency

I believe it is work in progress, they are heading in the right direction, BUT... it can change in a heartbeat.

Selling KAP shares was a must imo, perhaps they might even need to sell more, comforting part for me is they have it as an option to sell it cause if they did not, practically game over.

I still believe they can change it around, but i am also weary and yes i do appreciate Polly's views AND the other guys and having said that, to me it is pointing more in Polly's direction than the other guys BUT.........

How they handle this litigation (and outcome of it) is key for every1, including the creditors

my 1cent

 

and if u read Polly's comments....yes he is talking downside, but he's also aware that it could go on the upside, and just because his views are more downside does not make him wrong. fact is market is going downside

 

BUT..........

 

and i guess we're all playing for that fckn but to happen

[Lionelza1]

 

Hi Tom,
 
 I disagree with the words "bankrupt Steinhoff". 
 
Again, (this is now the third time that I have explained this to you), a business could be deemed insolvent when (1) the net assets are less than current net liabilities, or (2) when it is unable to pay its debts when they fall due. If a company takes steps to legally delay paying its debt and this is in agreement with the creditor(s) such a company is NOT deemed to be insolvent. 
 
Bankruptcy follows insolvency. It is a legal term where a business files for bankruptcy when they are unable to pay off their debts. 
 
Regarding Steinhoff, are you aware of anyone making claims in respect of the above Insolvency definition or Bankruptcy definition?  Please submit your proof.
 
I also believe that your assessment of the Seifert/LSW and Steinhoff is factually incorrect.
 
Seifert's matter that is before the courts, is that he does not see himself as a creditor but rather an owner of a business under dispute.  Steinhoff viewed him as a creditor and treated him as such under the LUA and CVA.
 
He is challenging Steinhoff's action.
 
Regards
Captainfrom82

 

Tom 2 comforting facts for me

1 - Creditors are giving steinhoff support - extremely important
2 - Customers are not boycotting steinhoff, steinhoff still generating sales

Take either 1 away and u have beginning of your insolvency

I believe it is work in progress, they are heading in the right direction, BUT... it can change in a heartbeat.

Selling KAP shares was a must imo, perhaps they might even need to sell more, comforting part for me is they have it as an option to sell it cause if they did not, practically game over.

I still believe they can change it around, but i am also weary and yes i do appreciate Polly's views AND the other guys and having said that, to me it is pointing more in Polly's direction than the other guys BUT.........

How they handle this litigation (and outcome of it) is key for every1, including the creditors

my 1cent

[Captainfrom82]

The reason why LSW (Seifert) don't want to go with the extra 10% interest rate offered by Steinhoff to the creditors, in exchange for them waiting 3 years, is probably Saifert applies his knowledge of Steinhoff, and believes that bankrupt Steinhoff won't be able to pay in 3 years, and he doesn't want to wait another 3 year years for the coming restrucutring, and he doesn't want anymore to be related to them, an doesn't want anything to do with their fraud.

 

Hi Tom,

 

 I disagree with the words "bankrupt Steinhoff". 

 

Again, (this is now the third time that I have explained this to you), a business could be deemed insolvent when (1) the net assets are less than current net liabilities, or (2) when it is unable to pay its debts when they fall due. If a company takes steps to legally delay paying its debt and this is in agreement with the creditor(s) such a company is NOT deemed to be insolvent. 

 

Bankruptcy follows insolvency. It is a legal term where a business files for bankruptcy when they are unable to pay off their debts. 

 

Regarding Steinhoff, are you aware of anyone making claims in respect of the above Insolvency definition or Bankruptcy definition?  Please submit your proof.

 

I also believe that your assessment of the Seifert/LSW and Steinhoff is factually incorrect.

 

Seifert's matter that is before the courts, is that he does not see himself as a creditor but rather an owner of a business under dispute.  Steinhoff viewed him as a creditor and treated him as such under the LUA and CVA.

 

He is challenging Steinhoff's action.

 

Regards

Captainfrom82

[JK001]

Agree 100% with DtD post.  Let's be a bit more transparent in our posts and let me explain:

 

you can post:  in my opinion SNH is bankrupt because I think SNH Debt exceed potential income and combined potential liquidated asset value.

 

you cannot post: SNH bank account empty (unless you are the treasurer or CFO of SNH) or work for a bank where SNH bank (In which case you can pack your bags because that would be immediate dismissal - confidentially breach and all those pretty things).  If not, then you are just speculating and making a Troll of yourself and setting yourself up for a hammering.  If you have the serious desire to just waffle, that is what facebook is for.

 

So here it goes: In my opinion KAP is not core to SNH business and strategically SNH made a handsome profit on it.  Just like most of us that own a share and see that this share is not performing as desired for whatever reason is going to give us lower returns than when applied elsewhere we sell it.  Not so easy to go into your trade tool and put 600 million shares up for sale. NAV did not reduce as the value is now just a different general ledger entry. You are not going to get the growth rate in KAP  (based on share performance for last few months) than for example using the R 4.8 billion to expand Pepco in Europe or to payoff a claimed creditor that is blocking progress.  Current management in SNH has proven to me (again an opinion), that they are more than capable to navigate rough seas.  They appointed the best of the best turnaround SMEs. I expect to see more non-core and lagging operations being sold of for better use stabilizing/reducing debt and expanding the core profitable business. When this team succeed SNH will be second only to IKEA.

 

Following is fact: I have not seen any retailer in SA doing as well as Pepkor did in 2018, happy to be educated if different evidence comes to light.

 

 

 

 

[DayTraderDad]

It's cowardly to insult people from behind screens.

 

You just want to people to write post so that other people buy and hold this worthless share, risking one day to lose their money when Steinhoff creditors or court decide to place it under liquidation.

But all what matters to you is that some how the share price goes up and you make some money.

 

Most of your post are false informations, and lies, and then repeat and repeat of the false informations and lies.

 

You say Polly started with you, but I have never insulted you, yet you keep posting (coward) insults at me from behind your screen.

 

I can also post insults if I want, but I choose not to, because I consider it to be cowardly, and the ones that do it are cowards, and should have no respect.

No you got me wrong I am no coward would tell it face to face the same so let me explain.

 

Firstly I have no desire to sell the SNH or in mater of fact any share to no one( It was the few that said that I am lying to pump - which I don't even understand this word pump)  further I recognise what ever I say in this forum will not do anything to the share price so have absolutely no agenda.

 

However as a shareholder of SNH will lot allow people to continue running the company down with vague unsupported wild statements.

 

I joined this forum to learn, exchange ideas and ketchup with news/ideas that different people have but guess what I have seen: 

1 - Very few people comment  - The reason being you post something and soon after that your head is bitten off by the doom sayers which I now call TROLLS

2 - A few people are always bashing the share immaterial what is said there is always a negative alternative by the few and provide no backup only wild statements with hate. Now call them the TROLL GROUP.

3 - People that have a problem with SNH are everyday forcing they thoughts of prepare for the end dooms day coming treating everybody like children going to Sunday school.

 

We are not stupid people on the forum that need to have the teacher telling us everyday to prepare for the end of SNH the end is near brace yourselves etc.

 

I can understand contrarian attitude/comments that comes with facts/figure to prove the reasoning which is useful to allow people to think and make use of the information but to just continue share bashing with vague statements its difficult to understand.

 

When trying to understand why you guys are continue doing this (everyday) it was when I ran into the definition of a TROLL and if you read what I posted its exactly what you guys are doing.

 

It could be that you are doing it innocently (would like to give you the benefit of doubt) but other are doing it purposely. 

 

There is nothing wrong posting articles yet your aim is always to only highlight the negative wording and ignore the positive wording news on the same article.

 

Why don't you go back to your post for today and try understand what I am saying:

 

Your post:

So Steinhoff sold KAP at 10% less then the yesterday closing price.

 

Well they have to, as their bank accounts are dry, and the creditor wouldn't give them more debt, and their business is just burning cash, where else then will they pay for their expensive so called debt restructuring (should be called debt ballooning).

 

 

 

So how do you know what is the banking situation? Do you have access to the bank statements?

Who do you know creditors have refused to fund SNH? Last I heard they happy to go on with the CVA (Over 93%)

How do you know the business are burning cash when PEPCO Europe has a strong cash flow? Yesterday Toll Polly said they paying R540 mil a day for experts Way out of the mark.

 

Look I could go on and on but you see what I mean about fake news/trolls!!!! Do yourself a favour get a beer and then read the various post this morning and you will see what I mean.

[Midas1]

Ok..hope victory dance comes soon

[DayTraderDad]

Bought them kap at R7.00,,,15000..lets see what rest week brings

I also bought at 7.00  liked your thoughts should reset to the 7.60 soon.

Edited by DayTraderDad, 27 March 2019 - 05:41 PM.

[Midas1]

Bought them kap at R7.00,,,15000..lets see what rest week brings

[Tom]

Another Mini Mi TROLL

 

It's cowardly to insult people from behind screens.

 

You just want to people to write post so that other people buy and hold this worthless share, risking one day to lose their money when Steinhoff creditors or court decide to place it under liquidation.

But all what matters to you is that some how the share price goes up and you make some money.

 

Most of your post are false informations, and lies, and then repeat and repeat of the false informations and lies.

 

You say Polly started with you, but I have never insulted you, yet you keep posting (coward) insults at me from behind your screen.

 

I can also post insults if I want, but I choose not to, because I consider it to be cowardly, and the ones that do it are cowards, and should have no respect.

Edited by Tom, 27 March 2019 - 05:35 PM.

[DayTraderDad]

Better add this is my opinion at your own risk blah blah

Hahaha 

[Midas1]

Better add this is my opinion at your own risk blah blah

[Midas1]

Jeez please make own decision...but i think could be bit rope upwards in few days..

[Tom]

From:

 

https://www.bloomber...ining-kap-stake

 

"

...

 

Steinhoff ... the embattled retailer looks to shore up its balance sheet.

 

... sold its 26 percent stake in the South African industrial company at a 9.4 percent discount to Tuesday’s closing price, Steinhoff said in a statement on Wednesday. The company said the proceeds will help ensure it has enough cash to fund other units as it seeks to restructure debt.

 

The move follows similar disposals of stock in Pepkor Holdings Ltd., ...

 

... KAP and Pepkor have been seeking to distance themselves from the troubled retailer

 

...

 

Edited by Tom, 27 March 2019 - 04:44 PM.

[DayTraderDad]

Bought kap trade think could be opportunity for long

Thanks its a good idea!

[Midas1]

Bought kap trade think could be opportunity for long

[DayTraderDad]

Bankrupt Steinhoff is not only burning cash, but also burning assets, where have all the assets/cash gone that they have realized since the on going fire sale it's been 15 months ... fat salaries ... cost of ballooning debt restructuring .... costs of auditors that hasn't ended yet ... lawyers fees ... cost of loss making businesses ... 

Another Mini Mi TROLL

[Tom]

Bankrupt Steinhoff is not only burning cash, but also burning assets, where have all the assets/cash gone that they have realized since the on going fire sale it's been 15 months ... fat salaries ... cost of ballooning debt restructuring .... costs of auditors that hasn't ended yet ... lawyers fees ... cost of loss making businesses ... 

Edited by Tom, 27 March 2019 - 02:30 PM.

[andi222]

Just to give you guys something to think about:

 

1 - KAP the only thing it contributes to SNH cash flow is the dividends which the last one was R0.23. So that means a return in investment of 3.34% yet SNH paying 6% to 10 % interest.

2 - The prospects of KAP share price taking off into the sky is limited so growth will be limited however we know the SA economy is in a bad shape.

3 - There is a strong possibility of a further downgrade of SA to junk status very soon which will possibly take the Rand to R18 to the Euro.

 

So for any astute business man it is a no brainer this was the best route to take and has nothing to do with bankruptcy etc.

 

Yes agreed, was a good step to sell the remaining shares. They need this additional cash flow to be able to act fast. The next 4 weeks are vital for the company. 

[DayTraderDad]

quit dreaming.....any bad news is good news for you!!  told u if company is liquidated tomorrow via a sens announcement , that will be good news too....

Please go and TROLL somewhere else!!!