15225 replies to this topic

[DividendTycoon]

The fact that the directors spent an estimated R5bn of the R16.4bn proceeds from their recent listing of Steinhoff Africa Retail on Steinhoff International tells you where the directors believe the most potential is. In particular, they believe the legal action which caused the drop in the share price is spurious and believe the share price will recover once the case is resolved (should be end of November).

On the whole I would agree with you, that is a good sign and it could be under valued. Personally I am a bit shy of Steinhoff because It is not easy to understand the accounts and they make a lot of large acquisitions, but would agree on the face of it the business is a good one.

 

The point I was making is that I take specific forecasts, like 41% gain in one year, with a large pinch of salt as nobody knows the future, and I bet those analysts would not bet their life savings on even predicting a 10% increase in the share price.

[Bullhunter]

Wonder how many of those analysts sold everything and put everything into Steinhoff with the expectation of that brilliant 41% return..

The fact that the directors spent an estimated R5bn of the R16.4bn proceeds from their recent listing of Steinhoff Africa Retail on Steinhoff International tells you where the directors believe the most potential is. In particular, they believe the legal action which caused the drop in the share price is spurious and believe the share price will recover once the case is resolved (should be end of November).

Edited by Bullhunter, 03 November 2017 - 11:03 AM.

[DividendTycoon]

The Thomson Reuters average analyst valuation for Steinhoff is R85. With the share currently trading at around R60 per share, this suggests that there is a one-year potential upswing of 41%.

 

https://www.fin24.co...inhoff-20171030

Wonder how many of those analysts sold everything and put everything into Steinhoff with the expectation of that brilliant 41% return..

[Bullhunter]

The Thomson Reuters average analyst valuation for Steinhoff is R85. With the share currently trading at around R60 per share, this suggests that there is a one-year potential upswing of 41%.

 

https://www.fin24.co...inhoff-20171030

[Blackobar]

There'll always be suckers ready to be licked, don't be that sucker.

[Shi]

Given the huge volumes this morning and the lack of price increase, it seems investors is not believing much directors put out on SENS yesterday. 

[CrescoRSA]

Wont be surprised if this one goes down to R45 in the coming weeks...bad news!!! 

[Spree]

Good point, Goliath. Thanks.

You can add EOH, another former market darling to that list!

Strange that there has not yet been any sens released by Steinhoff, to calm the market and sooth shareholders concerns!

This is when your European listing could seriously backfire -- those EU regulators do not mess around when it comes to issuing fines!

[Goliath]

Do you guys think that this is a good buying opportunity, or should we wait for more clarity?

If the company is found guilty, what are the potential ramifications and effect on the company and share price? Are there more skeletons in the closet?

Or, is this a company we should steer clear of?

 

If you're a gambling man why not? But the market doesn't like something like this, just look at Pinnacle and how long it took for them to recover from dodgy directors..

[Spree]

Do you guys think that this is a good buying opportunity, or should we wait for more clarity?

If the company is found guilty, what are the potential ramifications and effect on the company and share price? Are there more skeletons in the closet?

Or, is this a company we should steer clear of?

[Rulz3]

A translation from a German magazine below:

 

The public prosecutor's office in Oldenburg is investigating the chairman of the furniture manufacturer Steinhoff, Markus Jooste, because of the suspicion of the balance sheet forgery. This is reported by the manager magazine in its new edition, which will be available on Friday, August 25th. In addition, another high-ranking group manager as well as two other men from the MDax Group, the second largest European furniture manufacturer behind Ikea and the "Poco" furniture market, were accused.

The public prosecutor's office, which has been established since 2015, has the suspicion that "excessive revenues have been included in the balance sheets of group-owned companies". The background is contracts for the sale of intangible assets and / or company shares. Sellers and buyers were companies that were to come from Steinhoff. According to the public prosecutor's office, the various transactions are "three-digit millions". She rejected a comment on the names of the accused.

 

During raids in the offices of the Steinhoff-Europa headquarters in Westerstede as well as in the private homes of two Steinhoff confidants, the investigators ensured documents, which are supposed to have been signed by Andreas Seifert, co-managing director of the XXXLutz furniture chain.Seifert told the manager magazine that he had "never seen the papers before and had not signed them". He filed a criminal complaint for counterfeiting.

 

The Steinhoff Group, which also includes the German Möbeldiscounter Poco, employs more than 130,000 people on five continents. In the first six months of the current financial year, the company's financial position has deteriorated. The operating profit margin fell from 11.6 to 8.8 percent. Net debt fell from 2.9 to 6.5 billion euros.

Thank you for the info. Was worried it has something to do with Shoprite as well.

[DividendTycoon]

Anyone know why the sharp sell-off all of a sudden??

A translation from a German magazine below:

 

The public prosecutor's office in Oldenburg is investigating the chairman of the furniture manufacturer Steinhoff, Markus Jooste, because of the suspicion of the balance sheet forgery. This is reported by the manager magazine in its new edition, which will be available on Friday, August 25th. In addition, another high-ranking group manager as well as two other men from the MDax Group, the second largest European furniture manufacturer behind Ikea and the "Poco" furniture market, were accused.

The public prosecutor's office, which has been established since 2015, has the suspicion that "excessive revenues have been included in the balance sheets of group-owned companies". The background is contracts for the sale of intangible assets and / or company shares. Sellers and buyers were companies that were to come from Steinhoff. According to the public prosecutor's office, the various transactions are "three-digit millions". She rejected a comment on the names of the accused.

During raids in the offices of the Steinhoff-Europa headquarters in Westerstede as well as in the private homes of two Steinhoff confidants, the investigators ensured documents, which are supposed to have been signed by Andreas Seifert, co-managing director of the XXXLutz furniture chain.Seifert told the manager magazine that he had "never seen the papers before and had not signed them". He filed a criminal complaint for counterfeiting.

 

The Steinhoff Group, which also includes the German Möbeldiscounter Poco, employs more than 130,000 people on five continents. In the first six months of the current financial year, the company's financial position has deteriorated. The operating profit margin fell from 11.6 to 8.8 percent. Net debt fell from 2.9 to 6.5 billion euros.

[CrescoRSA]

Anyone know why the sharp sell-off all of a sudden??

[Spree]

Thank you Jack5

[Jack5]

Does anyone have an opinion of Steinhoff at these levels (R65)? Is this a decent entry point for long term accumulation? As usual, their results are not very easy to comprehend for the novice investor!

The Steinhoff business is a difficult one to understand because it keeps changing. They have been on a huge acquisition spree, and they need to start showing the results of these.

 

I personally like them because of the international exposure, and if their plan goes ahead to list their African assets separetly then it will be purely international earning foreign currency.

 

I think at R65 it's probably fairly priced at the moment, I am however hoping it goes a bit lower maybe below R60 but not sure it will get there.

 

I would love to hear other opinions too.

[Spree]

Does anyone have an opinion of Steinhoff at these levels (R65)? Is this a decent entry point for long term accumulation? As usual, their results are not very easy to comprehend for the novice investor!

[sommerso]

Hi Soletrader. 

 

Why exactly would they do that? What will they accomplish through this?

[SoleTrader]

Why will Steinhoff fall? 

 

Shouldn't they climb some, with Shoprite reporting 15% growth and having a higher share price? 

 

Just asking as I have no idea. 

 

The hedge funds will short Steinhoff against Shoprite.  Maybe its already happening!

[SoleTrader]

Why will Steinhoff fall? 

 

Shouldn't they climb some, with Shoprite reporting 15% growth and having a higher share price? 

 

Just asking as I have no idea. 

 

The hedge funds will short Steinhoff against Shoprite.  Maybe its already happening!

[sommerso]

Why will Steinhoff fall? 

 

Shouldn't they climb some, with Shoprite reporting 15% growth and having a higher share price? 

 

Just asking as I have no idea.