866 replies to this topic

[andi222]

Aveng Sens of today stated Allan Grey now holds 14.37% of Aveng shares. So will they then be selling some of there holdings already? this holding equates to some 2.73 Billion shares

 

Currently there is only 5,4 billion shares. So they only have 770 million shares left. I think they are trying to get to 10%.  But with these volumes being traded they will soon have sold all their holding at a big loss and when they are done selling out the share can go up hopefully. I don't understand why they are still selling shares at this price. 

[Trader001]

Aveng Sens of today stated Allan Grey now holds 14.37% of Aveng shares. So will they then be selling some of there holdings already? this holding equates to some 2.73 Billion shares? 

[andi222]

Polly, its not Aton thats disposing their shares. Its Allan grey. Hopefully they have sold enough sjares now. Wondering who is buying all these volumes tho?

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[JR7800]

Shi, that is correct.

[Shi]

 

1) They could have a capitalization. Which means they could convert 100 into 1 share for example. So if you hold 100 shares u would own 1 share after the capitalisation. Then market cap is 190 million.

 

 

Just to clarify, when shares are consolidated, the share price also moves in a similar way and the end result is usually an unchanged market cap. The consolidation is sometimes used to make shares more tradeable for example, if it is currently at 1c and gets consolidated to 100c.

[SB45]

So they have the following options:

 

1) They could have a capitalization. Which means they could convert 100 into 1 share for example. So if you hold 100 shares u would own 1 share after the capitalisation. Then market cap is 190 million.

 

2) They could buy back shares. As they have mentioned they see the price significantly under value. So they could slowly start buying back shares. They do have the money after all the capital transactions. Their net debt after all the transactions should be positive at 1, 4 billion rand. So they do have enough funds to buy back shares.

 

3) They could just leave everything as it is and keep the market cap at 19 billion. 

Thank you Andi,

 

I'm already riding this one already...see where it takes my bank balance

[andi222]

So Aveng will have 5,35Billion shares + 14Billion, which would 19 billion odd shares in issue. What would they do to solve this problem? Share buy back and cancel ? or merge?

 

So they have the following options:

 

1) They could have a capitalization. Which means they could convert 100 into 1 share for example. So if you hold 100 shares u would own 1 share after the capitalisation. Then market cap is 190 million.

 

2) They could buy back shares. As they have mentioned they see the price significantly under value. So they could slowly start buying back shares. They do have the money after all the capital transactions. Their net debt after all the transactions should be positive at 1, 4 billion rand. So they do have enough funds to buy back shares.

 

3) They could just leave everything as it is and keep the market cap at 19 billion. 

[Rex]

So Aveng will have 5,35Billion shares + 14Billion, which would 19 billion odd shares in issue. What would they do to solve this problem? Share buy back and cancel ? or merge?

 

Either way, the price should be going up

[SB45]

So Aveng will have 5,35Billion shares + 14Billion, which would 19 billion odd shares in issue. What would they do to solve this problem? Share buy back and cancel ? or merge?

[andi222]

These volumes        

[Matrix]

Still good volumes being traded today. I think there is still a major upside to this share. 

 

Agreed Andi.

 

Hopeful that the following week will be positive as the bond redemption and finalisation of transaction occurs over the next week.

This share does not seem to be gathering as much attention as Steinhoff, for obvious reasons.

The challenge with SNH is the mistrust, lack of confidence and variables involved.

I was heavily geared therein, but grew a bit impatient with the uncertainties.

 

People tend to forget that a share's price is irrelevant, and you just buy more at a cheaper price.

% Growth is the critical concern.

 

Decided to take a gamble on AEG and bought 7million at 3cent, following this thread. - Got out at SNH at break-even.

Fortunately it's already 100% up and on 6cent today, and would not have had a 100% growth on SNH.

Here's to hoping for a positive turn of events over the next week!!

[andi222]

Still good volumes being traded today. I think there is still a major upside to this share. 

[Trader001]

@andi222 and other participants

 

I have seen all the comments and tried to check what the JSE Sens rules are in terms of...when must a company declare its shareholding in another company ......I just could not find those rules but there must be ..and there are many learned friends on this chat site that might know the answer to this  and expand on it.

 

I am asking this to ..try to comprehend what Aton might be considering with Aveng or even MuR. I agree with you...don't think Aton is going to get out of this system by just selling..

too much to lose considering that MuR made it clear why they will re-consider  to buy Aveng at a later stage.

Also in the same vein..There seems to be a lot of institutional investors like Allan Grey ( and bondholders now) and the rest mentioned by you with a vested interest in Aveng that seems  not to want this company to go under and having the same view that it could prosper if the gov gets its act together and equate infrastructural development to economic growth and thereby boosting the construction industry in SA....

 

So my take on Aveng is..it won't go under..too much invested in it already my many . Aveng has got a good deal  to get bondholders to take ordinary shares instead..It is like a Steinhoff debt standstill agreement but without a date attached to it. Nevertheless Aveng will no have ample time to rescue the company and then think about a scheme to buy back all those ordinary shares issued for debt? when they are profitable and can afford it.

So I am really also long on this hare ..but if something comes along unexpectedly with a increase in share price , i will sell

[andi222]

So if I got my facts right the company will be basically debt free after all these transactions?

 

Interim net debt was sitting at 500 million. Now with the rights issue they got 500 million, they sold their properties for 290 million, they won 2 legal cases which gave them around 400 million and now they converting the bonds of 1 400 million. They will have cash for days. 

 

And they are considering selling their loss making operations. They will have such a big cash flow. That's a great opportunity for a take over then. Any ideas?

[Lionelza1]

Good to see this going up.... Albeit cent by cent haha... Just got some more.... 1st buy was at 9c

[andi222]

Some big buyer just entered  Good volumes trading today. I think we will see the 10 cents soon.

[Polly]

Would the Aton share not fall below 20 with the share issue ... ? There for not needing them to issue a Sens ?

Up to 5c

shares not yet issued...nevertheless if falls below different thresholds they need to disclose...i think intervals of 5% needs to be disclosed

[realkingkam]

Would the Aton share not fall below 20 with the share issue ... ? There for not needing them to issue a Sens ?

Up to 5c

[Polly]

And they would need to issue a SENS as soon as they sell. As they did where Aton acquired the 25 %. So doubt its ATON trying to get out.

 @ below 20 they would need too issue sens...watch this week

[andi222]

Actually think Aton disposing their stake slowly in the market which is depressing the share price.

 

And they would need to issue a SENS as soon as they sell. As they did where Aton acquired the 25 %. So doubt its ATON trying to get out.