15225 replies to this topic

[DayTraderDad]

While trading conditions continue to reflect a tough

global economy, at operating level Steinhoff remains

a geographically well-diversified, global retail group

providing everyday products at affordable prices,

through a stable of strong local brands. Businesses

such as Pepkor Africa and Pepkor Europe continue

to grow strongly while others such as Conforama,

Mattress Firm and Greenlit Brands hold positive

recovery potential.

[DayTraderDad]

Conforama and determined that the Group has retained control of Conforama. Management has similarly determined that Conforama had not met the

requirements to be classified as held-for-sale at the reporting date, or as a discontinued operation.

[DayTraderDad]

There we go!!!

 

http://www.steinhoff...ne-2019_WEB.pdf

[Investment novice]

No run on the share... Hence... Seems only feedback on managing legal risk would move the share

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[DayTraderDad]

Okay, I will bite.

 

Steinhoff International has multiple brands and companies associated with NV (I recall reading somewhere that there are well over 700 different subsidiaries).

 

Pepco, Poundland, Dealz, Pep&Co, Conforama, Benson for Beds, Harveys, Cargo, Fantastic Furniture, SleepMaster and Freedom are some of the brands and are all  wholly owned subsidiaries of Pepkor Europe (Confo deemed to be 50% now).  In fact, more accurately Bensons for Beds and Harveys are operating divisions of Steinhoff UK Retail Ltd who is a subsidiary of Pepkor Europe. 

 

To answer your question, if these companies had contributed to the most recent Goodwill and Intangibles of Pepkor Europe, and if they are sold off, this should see a decrease in assets.  But, if they had a carrying value of zero, then no further impairments were carried onto Steinhoff’s financials.

 

We do not have access to the underlying financials.  But my gut feel is that these companies had performed rather poorly over the past two years, and it would be surprising if the Goodwill had not been impaired already.  The intangibles should be a very small value.

 

FYI, as at 31 Mar 2019, PE’s carrying value measured in terms of Goodwill and Intangible Assets is 1666+276 = 1942 (all Euros).

 

Best Regards

Captainfrom82

 

Okay, I will bite.

 

Steinhoff International has multiple brands and companies associated with NV (I recall reading somewhere that there are well over 700 different subsidiaries).

 

Pepco, Poundland, Dealz, Pep&Co, Conforama, Benson for Beds, Harveys, Cargo, Fantastic Furniture, SleepMaster and Freedom are some of the brands and are all  wholly owned subsidiaries of Pepkor Europe (Confo deemed to be 50% now).  In fact, more accurately Bensons for Beds and Harveys are operating divisions of Steinhoff UK Retail Ltd who is a subsidiary of Pepkor Europe. 

 

To answer your question, if these companies had contributed to the most recent Goodwill and Intangibles of Pepkor Europe, and if they are sold off, this should see a decrease in assets.  But, if they had a carrying value of zero, then no further impairments were carried onto Steinhoff’s financials.

 

We do not have access to the underlying financials.  But my gut feel is that these companies had performed rather poorly over the past two years, and it would be surprising if the Goodwill had not been impaired already.  The intangibles should be a very small value.

 

FYI, as at 31 Mar 2019, PE’s carrying value measured in terms of Goodwill and Intangible Assets is 1666+276 = 1942 (all Euros).

 

Best Regards

Captainfrom82

Thanks Captain I am looking for a pleasant surprise tomorrow!!!

[Investment novice]

August 22, 2019

Mattress Firm to open in Northborough Crossing



Right sort of energy......

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[Captainfrom82]

Question for the accountants:

 

What will be the effect of the sale of Harvey and Benson for beds to the NAV of SNH?

 

Will there be further impairments because SNH paid 326 mil GBP so if selling in a hurry will this price be archived?

 

Any thoughts??

 

Okay, I will bite.

 

Steinhoff International has multiple brands and companies associated with NV (I recall reading somewhere that there are well over 700 different subsidiaries).

 

Pepco, Poundland, Dealz, Pep&Co, Conforama, Benson for Beds, Harveys, Cargo, Fantastic Furniture, SleepMaster and Freedom are some of the brands and are all  wholly owned subsidiaries of Pepkor Europe (Confo deemed to be 50% now).  In fact, more accurately Bensons for Beds and Harveys are operating divisions of Steinhoff UK Retail Ltd who is a subsidiary of Pepkor Europe. 

 

To answer your question, if these companies had contributed to the most recent Goodwill and Intangibles of Pepkor Europe, and if they are sold off, this should see a decrease in assets.  But, if they had a carrying value of zero, then no further impairments were carried onto Steinhoff’s financials.

 

We do not have access to the underlying financials.  But my gut feel is that these companies had performed rather poorly over the past two years, and it would be surprising if the Goodwill had not been impaired already.  The intangibles should be a very small value.

 

FYI, as at 31 Mar 2019, PE’s carrying value measured in terms of Goodwill and Intangible Assets is 1666+276 = 1942 (all Euros).

 

Best Regards

Captainfrom82

[DayTraderDad]

Question for the accountants:

 

What will be the effect of the sale of Harvey and Benson for beds to the NAV of SNH?

 

Will there be further impairments because SNH paid 326 mil GBP so if selling in a hurry will this price be archived?

 

Any thoughts??

[DayTraderDad]

Hi DTD,

 

I think that we must agree that we have a difference of opinion in this regard.  It is healthy and necessary for us not to agree on everything, and we must post our individual thoughts to avoid a herd mentality.

 

I just feel that after Steinhoff advised that it will dispose of non-core assets, that it is not necessary (and may even be detrimental) for them to alert the market for every single transaction, especially before they are in advanced stage of negotiations.

 

Please note that the obligation to infirm the market of material assets acquisitions and disposals will be informed by the relevant listing rules.  

 

Best Regards

Captainfrom82

Hi Captain,

 

Many thanks I agree and I am very confident that SNH management are excellent and will deliver on their promise.

 

Regards,

DTD

[Captainfrom82]

Thank Captain great post indeed lots of good work done. I just feel management need to up its game to take on negativity the latest example is the post I sent about the UK business for sale.

 

Hi DTD,

 

I think that we must agree that we have a difference of opinion in this regard.  It is healthy and necessary for us not to agree on everything, and we must post our individual thoughts to avoid a herd mentality.

 

I just feel that after Steinhoff advised that it will dispose of non-core assets, that it is not necessary (and may even be detrimental) for them to alert the market for every single transaction, especially before they are in advanced stage of negotiations.

 

Please note that the obligation to infirm the market of material assets acquisitions and disposals will be informed by the relevant listing rules.  

 

Best Regards

Captainfrom82

[DayTraderDad]

Celebrate what has been achieved thus far...

 

From suspicion and worry of October to 5 December 2017, to the the horror show that unfolded thereafter.  The Steinhoff management has undergone a huge change in personnel with the connected old guard making way for international heavyweights in the restructuring phase.

 

The management team have managed to: 

• Focus on re-establish stability within the Group’s operations. 
• Negotiate the LUA. 
• Agreeing and implementing the restructuring plan with the Group’s financial creditors.
• Improve governance at all levels.
• Dealing with LSW & Seifert on an ongoing basis.
• Trying to turnaround Kika Leiner and ultimately selling this business.
• Had an AGM under hostile circumstances.
• Oversee the PwC investigation and report.
• Determining the complex financial transactions, the corrections thereof, and effectively unscrambling the omelette.
• Invoking a Capter 11 restructuring and turning around the Mattress Firm business.
• Finalise the audited financial results for the 2017 & 2018 reporting periods.
• Engage with the various litigation (vendor and Shareholders).
• Now turning around and restructuring the Conforama business.
• Concluded an Investor Day presentation.

 

Despite comments to the contrary, Stakeholders have been kept informed by regular announcements released through formal channels.

 

I am invested for the long haul.  I believe in this management team, and I understand and agree with their vision and the plotted path to get there.  I believe that their strategy is correct and achievable all things considered.  I believe that they definitely have teh right people to get the job done.

 

The Negative Nellies must be horrified and deeply upset that their predictions of doom and gloom have not materialised.  Remember those predictions of bankruptcy, the share price going to zero, creditors calling in their credits, blah blah blah...

 

Brace for more angry posts as they try and create a storm based on false news and hatred. 

 

Best Regards

Captainfrom82

Thank Captain great post indeed lots of good work done. I just feel management need to up its game to take on negativity the latest example is the post I sent about the UK business for sale.

[DayTraderDad]

There we go I believe the reason for the share movement:

 

I thought the reason for the debt restructure was to prevent fire sales!!!!

 

This is the issue I have with Steinhoff IR lack of communication and every time they leave themselves open to bad publicity.

 

As a investor in SNH get the news of a fire sale via the news papers.

 

We get told there will be no fire sales yet  the news paper stating a fire sale so who is correct!!

 

Article: Furniture stores have for-sale sign up

 

https://www.thetimes...38-47c3100effef

 

Highlight:

"Two furniture retailers have been put on the block as their South African owner has pledged to raise funds for its creditors from an asset firesale.

 

Advisers at PWC have been instructed by Steinhoff to have first round bids for Harveys and Bensons for Beds within the next couple of weeks before sealing a sale by the end of October, according to sources."

[Burnt as well]

Celebrate what has been achieved thus far...

From suspicion and worry of October to 5 December 2017, to the the horror show that unfolded thereafter. The Steinhoff management has undergone a huge change in personnel with the connected old guard making way for international heavyweights in the restructuring phase.

The management team have managed to:

• Focus on re-establish stability within the Group’s operations.
• Negotiate the LUA.
• Agreeing and implementing the restructuring plan with the Group’s financial creditors.
• Improve governance at all levels.
• Dealing with LSW & Seifert on an ongoing basis.
• Trying to turnaround Kika Leiner and ultimately selling this business.
• Had an AGM under hostile circumstances.
• Oversee the PwC investigation and report.
• Determining the complex financial transactions, the corrections thereof, and effectively unscrambling the omelette.
• Invoking a Capter 11 restructuring and turning around the Mattress Firm business.
• Finalise the audited financial results for the 2017 & 2018 reporting periods.
• Engage with the various litigation (vendor and Shareholders).
• Now turning around and restructuring the Conforama business.
• Concluded an Investor Day presentation.

Despite comments to the contrary, Stakeholders have been kept informed by regular announcements released through formal channels.

I am invested for the long haul. I believe in this management team, and I understand and agree with their vision and the plotted path to get there. I believe that their strategy is correct and achievable all things considered. I believe that they definitely have teh right people to get the job done.

The Negative Nellies must be horrified and deeply upset that their predictions of doom and gloom have not materialised. Remember those predictions of bankruptcy, the share price going to zero, creditors calling in their credits, blah blah blah...

Brace for more angry posts as they try and create a storm based on false news and hatred.

Best Regards
Captainfrom82

Hi Captain, you make some good points and I also believe that the new management has done an excellent job. However, I think I shat my pants when price dropped to 87 cents! I almost sold out below R1 which would have crystallized a huge loss as emotions would have dictated that trade. Fortunately decided to hang on abit longer. But I must say that this share is starting to give me nightmares!

[Captainfrom82]

Celebrate what has been achieved thus far...

 

From suspicion and worry of October to 5 December 2017, to the the horror show that unfolded thereafter.  The Steinhoff management has undergone a huge change in personnel with the connected old guard making way for international heavyweights in the restructuring phase.

 

The management team have managed to: 

• Focus on re-establish stability within the Group’s operations. 
• Negotiate the LUA. 
• Agreeing and implementing the restructuring plan with the Group’s financial creditors.
• Improve governance at all levels.
• Dealing with LSW & Seifert on an ongoing basis.
• Trying to turnaround Kika Leiner and ultimately selling this business.
• Had an AGM under hostile circumstances.
• Oversee the PwC investigation and report.
• Determining the complex financial transactions, the corrections thereof, and effectively unscrambling the omelette.
• Invoking a Capter 11 restructuring and turning around the Mattress Firm business.
• Finalise the audited financial results for the 2017 & 2018 reporting periods.
• Engage with the various litigation (vendor and Shareholders).
• Now turning around and restructuring the Conforama business.
• Concluded an Investor Day presentation.

 

Despite comments to the contrary, Stakeholders have been kept informed by regular announcements released through formal channels.

 

I am invested for the long haul.  I believe in this management team, and I understand and agree with their vision and the plotted path to get there.  I believe that their strategy is correct and achievable all things considered.  I believe that they definitely have teh right people to get the job done.

 

The Negative Nellies must be horrified and deeply upset that their predictions of doom and gloom have not materialised.  Remember those predictions of bankruptcy, the share price going to zero, creditors calling in their credits, blah blah blah...

 

Brace for more angry posts as they try and create a storm based on false news and hatred. 

 

Best Regards

Captainfrom82

[Investment novice]

Just a thought... Not yet factored all implications.... Trying to preempt all potential scenarious.... Snh is in a preacrioud position and ita never going to be daya to day same old same old for the holding entity....





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[Captainfrom82]

Hope that startegy re legal etc are presented..... Would laugh my socks off if they put the resolution to delist..amd offer the market r3 or even r4 per share.... You all think i am smoki ng green stuff or drinking green beer... Deliating saves the xompany lots of headache... They can relist with a equity settlement to all claimants with a new found significantly higher price.... 3x what they would delist at......... Settlement des not have to be an acknowledgement of guilt... Can be an overture...


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IN, we have spoken of this delisting proposal of yours on many occasions.

 

I have no doubt that you believe that this is a necessary thing for value to be found in Steinhoff.  Maybe you are even correct although I have serious reservations in this regard.

 

However, you have failed to advise on how do you see this process unfolding.  I have advised on many occasions that delisting is not up to the directors.  They need to make a case and even agree a price at which the delisting would be achieved.  This must then be put to the vote to all shareholders excluding the shares that management hold.  If there is a significant shareholder on the company board, their shares are precluded from this vote.

 

Only if the vote passes by the requisite majority would the delisting proceed.  If there is not enough support for this, the company may approach the courts.  But this then just gets very messy indeed.

 

The other way to obtain shareholder support would be to offer a premium to the current shareprice.

 

You may think that this is a good thing.  But I can tell you that with the exception of the cases where the company is being privately acquired and thus delisting is required, almost without exception a hostile delisting is a very negative thing.

 

Once the share is delisted, the trading possibility of allowing you to sell your share shrinks to an infinitesimally small number of willing buyers.  A selling shareholder would receive a fraction of his purchase price.   

 

Every bit of protection that shareholders now enjoy through the JSE, Frankfurt or LSE would evaporate in a second.  As a shareholder you woudl enjoy no automatic protection other than the option of going privately through the Courts.  You would not easily have sight of management's strategic plans, or even if they are doing something illegal. 

 

I can assure you buddy, that your strategic thoughts in this regard is respectfully incorrect.  Shareholders would be in an enormous disadvantage  where Steinhoff to delist. 

 

Your thoughts that it would allow them to get their house in order and to then relist is incredibly naive. 

 

Are you certain that you do not mean a suspension of the listing of the shares?  This is different and does not need shareholder approval (think Tongaat Hulett).

 

Regards

Captainfrom82

[Investment novice]

The rise we see I feel is similar to what we've seen before, pattern is the same in anticipation of news, financials etc, and not as a result of leaked info

Correct agm next Friday I did not notice, perhaps that could be the game changer in market pattern

Hope that startegy re legal etc are presented..... Would laugh my socks off if they put the resolution to delist..amd offer the market r3 or even r4 per share.... You all think i am smoki ng green stuff or drinking green beer... Deliating saves the xompany lots of headache... They can relist with a equity settlement to all claimants with a new found significantly higher price.... 3x what they would delist at......... Settlement des not have to be an acknowledgement of guilt... Can be an overture...


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[Lionelza1]

There’s 2 events next week, Q3 results on Thursday and AGM on Friday. The agenda is quite long with many resolutions required (e.g. Board member appointments and share capital). I expect the price to bounce about on Friday similar to last year’s AGM where it hit a 30% intraday high and then closed virtually flat by the close of market.

But I agree with you on the subsequent slow poison

The rise we see I feel is similar to what we've seen before, pattern is the same in anticipation of news, financials etc, and not as a result of leaked info

Correct agm next Friday I did not notice, perhaps that could be the game changer in market pattern

[Burnt as well]

My observations on market trend since ive been in on this share,

everytime we expected news we saw share price rise, after news came out share price dropped immediatley and continued to drop to new lows (slow poison)

I had a look at snh diary and see that q3 expected next thurs 29th Aug. Taking previous market trends into consideration, i anticipate a uprun till next wed. I anticipate the first dump in share price either 27th or 28th and then the second dump 29th when q3 is published. after that the slow poison

i expect to see a drop under R1 again next week

i am not here to gloat about ppl loosing their monies or whatever, i am here to learn

This is not me trying to be right, this is purely my observations

Hola if u experienced the same

There’s 2 events next week, Q3 results on Thursday and AGM on Friday. The agenda is quite long with many resolutions required (e.g. Board member appointments and share capital). I expect the price to bounce about on Friday similar to last year’s AGM where it hit a 30% intraday high and then closed virtually flat by the close of market.

But I agree with you on the subsequent slow poison

[Lionelza1]

My observations on market trend since ive been in on this share,

 

everytime we expected news we saw share price rise, after news came out share price dropped immediatley and continued to drop to new lows (slow poison)

 

I had a look at snh diary and see that q3 expected next thurs 29th Aug. Taking previous market trends into consideration, i anticipate a uprun till next wed. I anticipate the first dump in share price either 27th or 28th and then the second dump 29th when q3 is published. after that the slow poison

 

i expect to see a drop under R1 again next week

 

i am not here to gloat about ppl loosing their monies or whatever, i am here to learn

 

This is not me trying to be right, this is purely my observations

 

Hola if u experienced the same